Vintage Vst Plugins Package - What A Fiasco

[GPRS]

I am a SAM 9 user and really like the Vintage fx that come with it but I also use Protools LE for some things so decided to buy the Vintage plugins package as a download for 99 euros hoping to use them in PT with the FXPansion wrapper. Well, Magix took the money, charged me shipping costs (for a download?!), sent me an order confirmation, told me serial numbers would be sent in a subsequent email (which hasn' happened) and provided a link to download the demos which if I had the serial numbers could then be activated. Since then I've discovered the VST Rtas wrapper doesn't like any of the plugins so I'm left with demos, no serial numbers, and shipping costs for a product that more than likely I can't use in PT. I think Magix/SAM need to sort the online ordering out -it's a dreadful process. Other buyers beware!

[Abel nT]

I AGREE

Vst from magix are good, not very good.

Simply good.

Variverb -for example- is a good reverb, but the little pantheon.dll (free vst on lexicon audio cards) work with no lexicon cards (works in my m-audio 10-10) do not have so many options, but sounds more natural for me, have more AIR . . .

You can use am-xxxxx to try to imitate vintage warmer from psp (this is a real fiasco) and psp works in any daw.

all robotas, vitas, etc etc in samplitude 2008 are simply good, but are not vst, or vsti, only work in 2008 version, not in se or pro versions.

Is SO DIFFICULT MAKE A SIMPLY VST for magix developers hahahahaha

No, the problem are the f**** chiefs of the developers.

[jandrews]

To the Original Poster:

Have you checked your downloads area on Samplitude.com? I know that my serial numbers are listed in mine. I would also re-post this in the VST plugins forum. SamDev may have a recommendation for a VST rapper that works. Of course PT doesn't play nice with stuff that's doesn't fit inside their technologies. Charging shipping on a download? That doesn't sound right. Did you order from Magix or a supplier.

To the 2nd poster: The Samplitude plugin suite is not the same as the included plugs in "Samplitude 2008 (Magix Music Studio)". Sascha (the main plugin developer) has posted that those are the very "lite" versions. I would reserve judgement on the plugs until you try the full ones.

[ast]

I could see shipping costs being added if you choose a different address than German. Can't see any reason for that.

I will ask our Sales dept. to have a look into this.

Andre

PS: Moved to Plugin Forum

[Sascha]

I am a SAM 9 user and really like the Vintage fx that come with it but I also use Protools LE for some things so decided to buy the Vintage plugins package as a download for 99 euros hoping to use them in PT with the FXPansion wrapper. Well, Magix took the money, charged me shipping costs (for a download?!), sent me an order confirmation, told me serial numbers would be sent in a subsequent email (which hasn' happened) and provided a link to download the demos which if I had the serial numbers could then be activated. Since then I've discovered the VST Rtas wrapper doesn't like any of the plugins so I'm left with demos, no serial numbers, and shipping costs for a product that more than likely I can't use in PT. I think Magix/SAM need to sort the online ordering out -it's a dreadful process. Other buyers beware!

As the developer of the plugins, let me try to clear things up a bit.

VSTs internally use 'identifiers' that most hosts use mainly for preset handling. The ID system Steinberg once came up with, is, frankly spoken, a real joke (I would laugh my head off if it weren't that sincere). But remember, that was 1997 (!), so it might have been a bit naive, but still highly visionary at that time, and I do still respect them for this work.

They once set up a database, but most devs ignore it. Why? Because the ID is 4 characters! I mean, count the number of plugins you know and try to make up some cool IDs... so, in the end, most manufacturers just ignored the Steinberg database, everyone invented own ID's (at the risk of having one that's already taken) and most apps use the DLL name for identifying a plugin. For some reason, the fxpansion wrapper does not.

I've met Angus a few times, I'm sure he's one of the most clever guys in this field, but I still don't get it why they stick to the 'standard' this way, as even Steinberg don't stick the 'standards' they've once made. It's a risk.

Now, let me explain, why the wrapper fails here: Ecox & Corvex use the same IDs. This, to say it clear, was my fault. It slipped through the whole development and was never observed as having a negative effect. I discovered that myself when I was adding the 'console' in later plugin versions for handling programs & banks myself, independent from the host. Thing is, I couldn't just change the ID because then, all clients having saved presets on their disk would have trouble accessing them with either plugin.

So, the current state is that the plugins need a fix at least for the fxpansion wrapper. I don't know how many users actually use this combination, so I could probably say it's of lower priority. But I take it for serious, without any doubt.

I don't know if the wrapper allows for any workaround here. But I've made up a possible solution on our side, which will be included in the next update. I will contact Angus and ask if my solution complies with his current and future wrappers.

Question is 'when' a fix comes out. I'm currently working on an update of all the VST plugins anyway, which will include plenty of fixes as well as some new features (that are still secret). I estimate the work being finished at the end of the year, so with included testing it will hopefully be available in January. That's at least the plan.

I understand the hassle you've got on your side. I would feel pissed as well. At this point, I can only say 'sorry'.

Variverb -for example- is a good reverb, but the little pantheon.dll (free vst on lexicon audio cards) work with no lexicon cards (works in my m-audio 10-10) do not have so many options, but sounds more natural for me, have more AIR . . .

Understand, I love the 'classic' Lex sound, but pantheon.... you must be joking. The newer, smaller Lex devices don't play in the same league as the algos they are famous for.

I suppose you are refering to the MusicStudio2008/MusicMaker version of VariVerb. Frankly, it's only the name that's similar, but the algos are very different from the 'pro' version (in Samplitude/Sequoia as well as the seperate VST). The consumer reverb basically carries the algos that evolved in the VV pro's plate & retro algos later on, but are in a very early state. I once said on this forum that a source of inspiration was the LXP-1/PCM70. But as well as such dated Lex gear had limitations (one being naturalness), the 'consumer variverb' has limitations as well. But it's still better than what other host manufacturers include as stock reverb with their apps (which is mostly just cheap Schroeder/Moorer-type reverberation, often based on Freeverb).

According to pro users, the HQ algos on VV pro rival the best native ones available (two being AA & CSR) and even compete with VSS3, in terms of 'realism'. You may google for some reviews...

[Abel nT]

"Understand, I love the 'classic' Lex sound, but pantheon.... you must be joking. The newer, smaller Lex devices don't play in the same league as the algos they are famous for."

- No i am not joking.

I make money recording bands, and each minute is money. Variverb PRO (the best one from samplitude pro is installed in the main DAW) and belive, my drummer does not have time to investigate aldorithms bla bla bla . . . he wants results, speedly.

We have csr too, and csr of course, is nice, and complex. He can play a lot with reverbs in his free time, and make a patch, or 2 o 3 patchs, but if need a modification, is a 30 minutes modification in real time, and he does not have this time to play (paying other).

Kjaerhus free reverb is not good, is for childs, speedly, but for childs . . .

Pantheon is only a 890Kbs reverb, but makes the works fine (we do not like the short color options, but . . . pfffff)

SPEDDLY, chose one preset and make a mix between dry and wet . NO MORE OPTIONS.

we do not have time to put reverbs in voices or guitars, voice have a rack with tc electronic, and is recorded with real hardware reverb in real time. No spend time in test lots of reverbs and presets . . . WE ARE NOT A BIG STUDIO WITH LOTS OF MONEY (like most studios)

All instruments have racks and real things because is more cheap for uor clients a delay pedal from behringer (17 eur.) than 1 hour of trying presets with ecox (20 eur.)

(of course behringer pedal soud horrible, but that is not the question)

And when i am sitting in front of daw to make a first mix, i need to choose the best vst, but thinking in the 6 other mix for that day . . .

I always need a hotter vst for drum mixes. (we have mercury package from waves like first "munition") is a shame for waves, but do not have something like psp vintage warmer, and the times we try to use "your plugins" always get hot . . but fat, low and sub low frecuencies (in kick) dissapear.

this are only words, but this is the real life:

sample with am-pulse

(lots ofh highs and hisss, no control for low frecuencies)

http://www.ntstudios.es/samp/ampulse.mp3

sample with psp vintage warmer (the classic option)

http://www.ntstudios.es/samp/psp.mp3

There is a free vst in kvr called "crown preamp emulator" with only 2 buttons that sonds better in drums (ALWAYS FOR ME)

http://www.ntstudios.es/samp/crown.mp3

With reverbs happens the same . . . variverb is like a MATHEMATIC reberv, so many operations and options . . . . maybe is usefull to a competition with waves reverbs to se with is more complex (like impulse responses . . . ha ha ha)

No, i do not have time to go inside a cathedrall and recor my favourite response and apply after 2 weeks. I have a drummer sittin in a drum and need a good reberv inside the mix. And always the people choice presets from pantheon, and csr . . .

Is the true . . . and is sad, because i am the first that need a compact daw and i do not want spend money and time from here an there tryng now this, and that . . . pffff. . . .

Repeat.

Magix vst are fine, good . . . . but for our studio are not suitables.

[Sascha]

sample with am-pulse

(lots ofh highs and hisss, no control for low frecuencies)

http://www.ntstudios.es/samp/ampulse.mp3

sample with psp vintage warmer (the classic option)

http://www.ntstudios.es/samp/psp.mp3

There is a free vst in kvr called "crown preamp emulator" with only 2 buttons that sonds better in drums (ALWAYS FOR ME)

http://www.ntstudios.es/samp/crown.mp3

??????????????

What are you trying to prove here? I don't get it.

I mean, you apparently cranked up the 'HF details' knob on am-pulse, added saturation and wonder why the sound is overly trebly? Come on, I'm starting to doubt...

If you feel like complaining, which is a legitimate thing, then at least try to match sounds upon comparison or at least state what you've been doing and what the goal is. And please don't compare apples with pears.

It might be that recording musicians has to be perfomed quickly (ideas vanish when asking for patience in the studio, I know this). But when you compare stuff (at least on a professional scale, which I demand here), you have to take your time. Otherwise, things get totally subjective and implausible, which immediately bounces back to you.

A comparable tool to Vintage Warmer could be either am-track's tape simulation (which definetly adds lows, as a result of 'head-bump' simulation, plus offers control over the entire spectrum), or more versatile: am-munition.

[Proposal: post the original (dry) file here and I'll dial in some settings that easily match up with the other two examples (with the limitation that those two alone are totally inconsistent as well...)]

[Abel nT]

this have no sense . . .

am- ... are your plugins, and for you always be better

my child always be better than others

I can put my hands in the eras and repeat 1246 times (for me) algorithmix are the best, algorithmix are the best ,algorithmix are the best ,algorithmix are the best ,algorithmix are the best ,algorithmix are the best ,algorithmix are the best ,algorithmix are the best ,algorithmix are the best ,algorithmix are the best ,algorithmix are the best

But i have chose sonalksis eq in master, because algorithmix bla bla bla bla, so perfect, so . . . . .

of course one plugin can work for a person, for a group of persons (beta testers) . . . but if a plugin (or a program) is good or not, if work or not . . . in this days, is easy:

Open your mind and look at your side . . .

Cubase : 7743 Protools 3302 Samplitude 232

(source: http://www.hispasonic.com/comunidad/?sid=d...08d15d675be765)

Of course, i use samplitude and hate protools LE , but i do not sell samplitude to the people.

Am-track

(none found) (what the hell is am-track?)

Vintage warmer

438 found (30 pages)

(source: http://www.hispasonic.com/comunidad/search.php but u cant repeat test in kvraudio, etc etc . . .)

Popular is good?

no, of course . . . popular= not all the world have your vision or the vision on this forum.

why magix plugins are not popular, and the people do not have your wonderful point of view???

of course, because all of us are a little stupid and choose opel and not mercedes.

Magix plugins have the cost of mercedes and works poor than opel. This is the question.

ARE GOOD PLUGINS

But people wants more.

remember:

Most of the people can not make the "bob katz" wheather man experiment on tv . . . pffff

is not important or relevant if you can make variations in that file, i make this 3 files in 3 minutes.

am-plugins is like metal zone from boss. . . lots of variations, but none is usefull.

And most of the people do not spend more time in test your vst or a pedal in a shop.

Its sad, but is real.

...but, this it is your (and magix) sales problem, not me.

(i never have been used the insert effects or vst from magix)

if i need a channel eq, i go to roger nichols detailer. (i always try to make eq on hardware)

if i need a compresor, go to waves

if i need eco, go to waves

if i need chorus, go to free kjaerhus chorus (not corvex or waves stomp)

Ecox and corvex is like a "bee" in my head, always making the same unatural and bored sound.

Oh, yessss . . . the old tapes in 70's mixers are so funny . . . ha ha ha ha

like i said at top:

No sense discussion.

[Sascha]

No sense discussion.

Exactly.

So, as you've got nothing relevant to add and as I already addressed the original poster's problem, I will close the topic here.